Although sociologists often convey a grim message, I appreciate what they do. It’s been tremendously helpful for me to understand that scholars have actually studied and articulated names for phenomena like white privilege, and social constructs of gender and race and beauty.

These problems are real and pervasive; acknowledging their existence is the first step.

Afrobella:

I know you don’t write for Vogue Curves, but as you mentioned it, I was commenting on the poor quality of the writing of the item I read.

Re “shrill,” you can’t rely just on the dictionary definition. “Shrill” is a word that in America is undeniably associated with women as a pejorative. The word is almost never applied to men.

“Reader” thanks for sending the Sociological Images link, as a sociologist this is exactly where I’m coming from …

Excellent points. But I thought that black women were more than “potential consumers,” I thought they were MAJOR consumers, spending much more money on average than white women on cosmetics and clothing (and of course I’m aware of some reasons why this might be so, i.e., the need to make oneself “acceptable” in a still very white-dominated beauty aesthetic).

The argument used to be that few women of color models were used in runway shows because black women don’t buy couture. But only something like 30 women in the world can afford couture. As I noted earlier, it’s well established that many couture and high end fashion shows function essentially to create buzz for the brand, so that consumers believe they have a connection to, say, Chanel, when they buy things produced by manufacturers who have paid for a license to use the name.

If that’s really the way it works, then black women are entitled to expect more representation in the editorial component of the main magazine and in the advertisements.

I read Afrobella all the time and I think it has good tips. But I also read Sociological Images http://contexts.org/socimages/ a blog that several times a week explores how black women and other groups still considered “Other” are represented in this society.

and maybe this attitude has trickled over to Vogue Black. Honestly I think it’d be ridiculous for me to be angry about its existence, seeing as I do write for Black Voices, Black Atlas, and Afrobella which is also dedicated to pretty much exclusively celebrating our beauty.

Elizabeth, I understand your argument but I want to make one point – Vogue Black is NOT a magazine! I haven’t heard word of this coming to print. It’s an online channel on Vogue.it – comparable to how Black Voices is an online channel on AOL.com. And as of now, links to Vogue Black articles also appear prominently on Vogue.it. So I think they do plan to bring all of their inspirations together in the online form. Will this make it into print? Well that remains to be seen…

Oh! And reader – I’m not writing for Vogue Curvy (yet!) but I agree, and part of the issue is the language barrier. The Italian editors will probably read this post and these comments, so I think they’re learning our opinions and criticisms from all of this!

Black women have historically struggled for representation but we’ve also been the first ones to say that we want to viewed as “equally” human, “equally” beautiful. The images in Vogue Black ARE pretty and that’s great but I can count on one finger how many black women are in the general magazine and then there are no curvy women at all.

It’s more of the same … throw us something to distract us. Give us pretty pictures in a separate magazine but don’t change or challenge dominant ideas about beauty, whiteness, and thinness.

Our willingness to accept this without saying anything is what’s MOST problematic. For all of your comments about being “clueless” you Afrobella do recognize this which is why you, yourself “hope to see more integration …” You’re saying exactly what the nay-sayers are saying. Give us Vogue Black to recognize our unique beauty AND incorporate us into the mainstream beauty magazines.

The other alternative that no one has suggested is to just to call Vogue Italia what it is “Vogue White” and stop the pretense that it represents “general beauty”.

“So I was kinda surprised that [THIS TIME], the shrill voiced outrage…”

(Emphasis added).

Thank you for the clarification. I’m glad you can take civil, hopefully intelligent-sounding critiques from readers. (Some bloggers can’t — Don’t get me started…)

And as I said, I’m not really in the critics’ camp. I was trying to expand on what I thought the objectors had taken issue with. I believe I understand, and I think both sides are interesting; how to cope in the real world always is.

As for the value of Vogue Black and Vogue Curvy,* I don’t really know the answer. I like to read blogs for discussions like this.

I haven’t bought or even American Vogue for years because it was so ridiculous, the current trends in plastic surgery bothered me more than anything else, but I did shell out good money for the “Black” Italian Vogue issue, so if gimmick it was, it worked on this one.

Good luck with the Vogue work. It’s money and exposure. Money and exposure, good (I’m not an idiot.)

*Vogue Curvy can use some serious copy editing. There was a sentence so mangled that I had to read it three times before I realized it wasn’t me. And in what universe is Meryl Streep curvy? It turned out to be a tease.

I’ve looked at both Vogue black and V-curvy and I’m still waiting to be “wowed”. Just a collection of short vague articles.

Non white magazines such as Vogue are not going to cover our beauty needs and issues as thoroughly as a black beauty magazine. IMO, this is just a ploy to generate more money because it is a known fact that blacks are major consumers. What we need to be doing is giving Ebony and Essence more of our support.